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Full Transcript of Episode 07: Domestic Violence. How Prepared Are Churches and Pastors?
Lizette: [00:01] Podcasting from Nashville, Tennessee, this is “Keep Asking.” The weekly podcast that helps you dive in a bit deeper and wider into the research providing insight in today’s church and culture.
[00:23] Welcome back, guys. Welcome to our listeners also. We have a little bit of a heavier topic this week as we discuss some domestic violence research and how aware the church is of it going on. [00:43] Before we jump into that research, I thought, because this was a sponsored project, it might be a good idea to introduce some of our listeners to where our projects come from, the stork, if you will, of research projects. Scott, how does this work? How does this differ from the way we do other projects?Scott: [01:03] Much of the research that Lifeway Research does is for sponsors. These are other ministries and organizations that relate to the church. They essentially pay us to do the research for them.
[01:17] Thankfully, many times, they want that data shared with the public. That’s the case with this particular project.Lizette: [01:24] How did this conversation start?
Scott: [01:27] It actually came about through a couple of questions we had asked on one of our polls to help understand what’s going on in the culture today and what’s going on in the church. Since we had addressed domestic violence in the past, it really resonated with Autumn Miles.
[01:44] She’s someone who has a daily radio show entitled “The Autumn Miles Show.” She’s also the founder and CEO of the Blush Network. Autumn approached us and really was interested in learning more. She is someone who understands domestic violence firsthand unfortunately. [02:08] Even with that personal knowledge of the issue, she’s humble enough to know that there’s more she needs to know. She wanted to understand some things about the church today and how it’s responding on the issue of domestic violence. Clearly, this is an important topic for the church to be addressing today. [02:34] We’re so grateful for Autumn Miles, her ministry, for sponsoring this particular research, and hopefully that this research will create a conversation within many churches. Hopefully one that, even as we talk about it today, that the church is interested in being involved in.Lizette: [02:57] We know from our mental illness research we did a few years ago that the church and pastor specifically are a huge resource when it comes to individuals and families seeking out help, working through issues related to mental illness.
[03:14] By the way, I’ll include a link to that and the other resources Scott mentioned in the show notes. Do we have any clues on if the same thing applies to issues related to domestic violence?Casey Oliver: [03:26] We found that 37 percent of senior pastors know an adult in their church who has experienced domestic or sexual violence in the last three years.
Lizette: [03:36] Repeat that. How many pastors say they know?
Casey: [03:39] 37 percent. An additional 15 percent said that nobody had experienced in their church and 47 percent not that they know of.
Lizette: [03:50] That seems really low to me. Pulling up some stuff and I’ll have the links. Domestic violence, on average 24 people per minute are victims of rape, physical violence, or stalking by an intimate partner in the United States. Source: The National Intimate Partner and Sexual Violence Survey from 2010.
[04:16] Over the course of a year, that equals more than 12 million women and men. In just one day across the United States and its territories, more than 67,000 victims of domestic violence sought services from domestic violence programs and shelters. [04:34] One more, one in four women is the victim of severe physical violence by an intimate partner, while one in seven men experiences severe physical violence by an intimate partner at some point their lives, so one in four women and one in seven men. I have a hard time with that number.Casey: [04:54] It’s tough to reconcile that idea that if one and four women are, depending on which number were talking about there, is affected to say only 37 percent of churches knows somebody who is affected. Again, there’s that 47 percent who say, “Not that I know of.”
[05:12] A lot of those are an acknowledgment that, “It could be happening in my church and I wasn’t told about it or I wasn’t aware of it.” Some of the “not that I know ofs” are really “yeses.” Some of the “nos” are really “not that I know ofs.” [05:27] I also think that we’re aware that some behavior in the church, actually there are differences in terms of if you look at divorce statistics or a number of things. We would expect the picture in the church to at least be slightly better than for Americans as a whole as well.Scott: [05:45] One of the things that 37 percent indicates is that that there is a need for the church to be a more welcoming place to have that conversation. It is very difficult if you’re the one experiencing domestic violence to talk about it.
[06:01] It’s embarrassing. It’s shameful. It feels embarrassing. It feels shameful. It feels like something that you don’t want talk with others. It has to get really bad for you to bring up that topic and to share that with somebody. [06:17] We want that somebody to be those in the church who are ready to love that person and to help that person. There are two elements to that. One, as Casey mentioned, the number should be better in the church. [06:34] The power of Jesus Christ transforming people’s lives should mean that the numbers are not the same as our culture in general, but sin still exists in the church. It’s going to be there. There are family members that may not be believers where that’s also occurring. [06:50] At the same time, is it an opening and welcoming place in the church to be talking about that? The 37 percent indicates that for a lot of churches it’s not what they want it to be.Lizette: [07:03] Didn’t we see from the research that a lot of the churches think that they are?
Casey: [07:10] Yeah, we saw 98 percent say that a person experiencing domestic violence would find their church to be a safe haven including 87 percent who strongly agreed with that sentiment.
[07:22] Again, as we broke the numbers down further, what we also saw is that only just over half of churches have a plan in place for responding to someone sharing that they are experiencing domestic violence. [07:33] You have almost everyone, on some level, feeling like, “Yes, this is a place where people can come to and they’ll be welcomed and feel safe,” but also only half of them actually having prepared to be ready to minister to those people.Lizette: [07:51] That’s a pretty big discrepancy. I want to be careful and not sound like I’m trying to tell churches, “This is what you need to be doing or this is what you have to be doing.” With its prevalence and the fact that children are affected.
[08:07] That when and if this is happening to people in their church, that it’s not probably just one person it’s impacting. It’s impacting multiple people in their church. How do we think this data can help churches and organizations start the conversation or trigger higher awareness?Scott: [08:46] Because the data itself is based in the church setting, that’s the easiest application is in that setting. Thankfully having a sponsor like Autumn Miles in the conversation from the beginning, she was able to prompt us with some things to be asking that would be helpful.
[09:07] Knowing whether or not that church is ready to have the resources available is the most important thing. Obviously, having a plan, knowing that when that information is revealed. [09:24] Most pastors, hopefully most church leaders are going to be compassionate at that point and be ready to be that. That’s where that 98 percent comes in. That safe haven has probably more to do with their heart than it does their preparation. The step that most churches need to be taking is the preparations step.Casey: [09:44] We also saw, again speaking to Scott’s point about positive attitudes, empathy for that person, we asked the question, “If someone in your congregation files for divorce and cites domestic violence as the reason, what would your response likely be?”
[10:01] The lowest response out of all those options we gave them was to believe that domestic violence is not really present. We only saw one percent of pastors saying that, which is an encouraging sign that their initial reaction isn’t disbelief. [10:18] There is compassion and empathy, sometimes then hopefully preparation as well to go along with that compassion and empathy.Lizette: [10:25] The reality is how a pastor responds and how a church responds probably is hugely influenced by that pastor’s training, their thinking, background, and awareness of that beyond what’s just currently happening.
Scott: [10:48] Three out of four churches are prepared to refer to a counselor, somebody who’s trained in domestic violence. That’s something that’s very easy for a church to do is to have a list of names that they can refer someone to immediately.
[11:04] It’s something that one out of four churches hasn’t done. That’s an easy thing. That would definitely be on the short list. This is not an easy problem because the solution, the help that’s needed is probably going to be long‑term. [11:18] Some of the other preparation steps involved having finances ready to be able to help that person with some of the practical needs they’re going to have, a safe place to stay. Whether that’s something your church can provide, yourself, or whether you’re networking with some resources in your community, that’s a very important step. [11:38] Having a referral list for legal help. These tend to be messy situations. Legal counsel is often something that person’s going to need. The church can be helpful in making a referral there as well. One of things that less than half of churches have ready is someone who can talk with that person who’s actually experienced it themselves. [12:04] Again, because we’re not talking about in the church very much, we don’t even know some of the resources that we have within our church of somebody who’s experienced this in the past. [12:15] Again, the numbers in our society show that those people are present. Sometimes those experiences we have to suffer through are so that we can help others with those same experiences.Lizette: [12:28] A friend of mine, who’s a pastor’s wife, tells the story of her wakeup call and her husband’s first pastorate after they left seminary. She’d had a lot of fun in the programs they have for spouses of seminary students and a lot of learning some of the hospitality demands, expectations, and some extra Bible study skills.
[12:58] She was completely unprepared for the day that a young lady came to her house. This friend had laundry out on the couch. She didn’t have anything prepared as a treat or a baked good. What this young woman needed was help with a plan because she had just separated from her abusive boyfriend who was potentially coming after her with a weapon. [13:26] That was a wakeup call for that friend to say, “OK, I need to be thinking about a broader set of strategies.” She’s thankful for the other set because that other set helped her build some relationships so that members felt comfortable coming to her, but then knowing that plan. [13:46] To me, that’s that next step of the importance of a plan. It’s not just the willingness, but then, as you put the plan in place, are other people going to be in danger? This applies to organizations being more aware of what’s happening with people you may be working with or people you’re ministering to. [14:07] As we were talking about this study the other day, we…Hold on. I want to get to the one out of two problem. I want to toss it to you, to the one out of 1,000—the prevalence.Scott: [14:24] The relevance. Yes.
Lizette: [14:25] Yeah. Scott, we were talking the other day about how this appears like it’s not necessarily being addressed or talked about as much as the prevalence of it in our society would expect. If we think back on the cultural issues that our churches that have been addressing over the past year, this is potentially so much more common than any of those others.
[15:00] How can we encourage or what’s our hope, if we can be aspirational? We don’t want to tell people what to do, but I do on this one. I want to be really careful. Say your really smart thing that you said the other day.Scott: [15:18] The relative size of a need needs to impact our willingness to be involved. A need like this, every church needs to be prepared to help. That help may be a referral. It may be a handoff, but it is making sure that person gets the help they need.
[15:37] Being aware and having that plan in place, it should not be burdensome. It’s a very doable process to know counselors, to know where shelters are, and to be aware of those things. As we think of leading a ministry, in total, the relative size of a need is a very important piece of your strategic thinking. [16:00] When there’s a need in a community like the need to be helping those who are experiencing domestic or sexual violence, and we know that one out of four women is experiencing this, even the smallest church, the odds are your families are touching someone who’s experiencing this. [16:22] It’s something that we need to be seriously considering as a ministry that our church addresses. There are other needs out there that only one person in 1,000 experiences. It’s still a very real need. It still may be something that needs to be addressed, but the relative size of it is much smaller. [16:46] As a church, and definitely this applies to ministries as well, as you’re seeking God’s guidance in what needs your ministry or your church needs to be addressing, God may call you to some of those tiny needs that only one in 1,000 people have. [17:04] You’re probably the only church or the only ministry in your area that needs to take care of that because it’s a small need and you might be able to handle it. There are bigger needs that are so prevalent that we need to be involved at least to some extent. [17:19] Even if it’s support and pointing people to some of the other ministries or other churches that are better equipped to meet that need. Some of those bigger needs like domestic violence, others would be things like divorce, things like tutoring in schools. Those are big needs in society where the numbers are just astounding. [17:41] One church, one ministry cannot conquer those on their own. Each of us need to have those on our radar to say, “How can we be supportive? How can we be a partner on those bigger issues that are so prevalent?”Lizette: [17:56] As we process this and talked about it, on the idea of becoming aware of prevalence, that’s where we can do another plug as we’ve done in other podcasts about how data can help shape your thinking.
[18:15] It’s so easy based on what someone on TV or what someone has written to get emotional or wound up about something because a very good communicator is wound up about it or has put a spin on it. [18:34] This is where research can have, data can have a very emotional impact and it can balance the playing field. It can give you some tools if you know where to go and where to get access. We’re going to provide some of those in our show notes online at lifewayresearch.com for this particular topic. [18:56] On any topic, if you can look at the data, if you can take the time to say, “OK, what’s really happening? What’s the picture?” for your own emotional well‑being, it can help keep things more even keel in this somewhat turbulent time of how everybody’s trying to get everybody wound up about everything. [19:16] It was John Piper who used the phrase “compassion fatigue.” He gets tweeted at all the time. I’m pulling this back from a year and a half ago. I saw him on a webcast or something. People are always tweeting, “Aren’t you outraged about this? Aren’t you outraged about that?” [19:36] All of us only have so much outrage. There are horrible things happening every day. There are wonderful things happening every day. We need step back, not always let the emotions drive it. Then, once we know what the situation is, get emotional and get wound up about the good causes. [19:58] That was a little bit of a soapbox. I hope you guys are OK with that.Scott: [20:04] One of the things that every ministry needs to be thinking about is do they have research on the needs and the context that their ministry’s functioning in. What we saw here was Autumn Miles knows this topic really well, but she had the humility to say, “There are some things I don’t know. I don’t know exactly how many churches are responding in what way even though I’m prepared to help them.”
[20:34] As ministry leaders, we think we know the need, especially the need that our ministry exists to meet. The reality though is we probably don’t personally have that need. We need to hear from the people who do have that need. [20:48] We also need to be partnering with people to meet that need. We need to hear from those partners what would it take to get them involved. This is a great example where research on needs and the context of that need is so helpful in making ministry decisions.Lizette: [21:04] If your church, your class, your organization, or even you and some of your colleagues take a closer look at this data and begin to process it, become more aware and take any action, any step, we’d love to hear about it, we like learning.
[21:25] Probably one of our favorite things with research is when we see people taking action on it. That’s when we know. That’s the fulfilling thing.Lizette: [21:38] Sometimes looking at numbers and doing fun things is also bizarrely fulfilling and finding patterns. I’ll confess that. We would love to hear that, if you were able to take one step or gain some new insight.
[21:51] Also, if you liked what you heard today, we would really appreciate it if you could pop into iTunes, rate the podcast positively as I’ve asked before. Feel free to let us know any suggestions, questions, comments, critiques via email or Twitter. [22:08] You can email us your feedback and ask questions about this project and the research or questions about research in general at [email protected]. Be sure to Tweet your questions and comments to us: @LifewayResearch and individually: @smcconn, @statsguycasey, and @lizettebeard. Join us next time for another edition of Keep Asking.Links and resources of interest
- 10 steps to prepare your church for domestic violence AutumnMiles.com
- Good Intentions, Lack of Plans Mark Church Response to Domestic Violence Lifeway Research
- 5 Facts about Crime in the U.S. Pew Research